You can buy Bitcoin at 107.000 or Monero at 400

uses pos fud meme against monero

nodes are not enough decentralized

nothing in life is. this is the Zipf law. It applies to everything, also to economics, networks, friendships, businesses, words, all of life.

There is no downside from it.

I will pretend to not read the more detailed replied about why monero's ASIC-less PoW is worse that ASIC PoW

try again: >miners are invested in, they give something else to get into BTC. ok that is true for all PoW. But ASICs are a bit stronger commitment, they can't really use their investment for anything else if BTC would fail. They *must* defend the network.

Hes right about finite emmision, historical ly systems with this quality end with a mad dash to the door, luckily there is still time to find a solution

Ok do you maxipads now really say there is no downside to centralization? Holy shit
Im not that technical but all you seem to describe is that its good because big miners like it and shill bitcoin as result? Thats not inherently good

there is no downside to centralization?

there is no big downside to the fact that we do not have some perfect-decentralization, in the fact that some nodes are more popular others are less.

monero mining also is "centralised" in your stupid terms, or "not fully decentralised". the biggest miners are hackers running botnets.

same happens for all PoW mining, and for all PoS.

nothing is perfect but it works.

there is no real downside to the level of decentralisation that LN has now, you can no problem find new peers and route to anyone

yeah no thanks I prefer dedicated miners.

Dedicated hardware = glaring weak link. All it takes is an import embargo and network security begins burning out.

In other words, ASIC dependence = permissioned mining.

All it takes is an import embargo and network security begins burning out.

anyone can make sha256 ASICs, it is one of easiest devices to make.

only China makes CPUs (that count). so yeah XRP is worse actually here too.

anyone can make sha256 ASICs, it is one of easiest devices to make.

Give me a fucking break, DIY miners pale in comparison to modern, professionally manufactured Bitcoin ASICs. Manufactured ASICs today achieve on the order of 10–15 J/TH, while homebrew FPGA or custom‐ASIC projects - even the most optimized - are typically in the tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands J/TH range. That means a roughly 1,000x - 10,000x efficiency gap in favor of factory-produced miners.

Manufactured ASICs are co-designed with optimized power gating, specialized arithmetic units and multi-die modules. DIY designs lack the CAD tools, EDA flows and wafer-level tuning to approach those efficiencies. Furthermore, professional rigs employ finely tuned immersion or hybrid cooling, voltage regulators and PCBs engineered for minimal IR drop. Homebrew setups typically rely on generic boards, box-fan cooling and sub-optimal power infrastructure.

And then there's economies of scale: Bitmain, MicroBT, Bitdeer, etc fabricate millions of chips per quarter, amortizing R&D and tooling costs across huge volumes. A homemade ASIC prototype is effectively a one-off with no scale advantages. Thus for BTC mining, the performance and efficiency delta makes DIY rigs uneconomic by several orders of magnitude.

Bottom line: if your goal is throughput per watt (and thus profitability), commercial ASICs are the only viable path. Homebrew FPGA or custom ASIC projects remain interesting intellectually but their efficiencies (tens to hundreds of thousands J/TH) pale next to the ~ 10 J/TH frontier of today’s factory-built Bitcoin miners.

And that's why BTC mining corps all import their ASICs rather than building them locally in-house. So point still stands, ASIC-dependant BTC mining is fundamentally permissioned and vulnerable to State interference at any moment.

only China makes CPUs (that count)

General-purpose CPUs are not at risk of an embargo, dipshit.

DIY miners pale in comparison to modern, professionally manufactured Bitcoin ASICs.

I talk about professional sha256 ASICs.

There are probably more than 1 fabs in the world that can make them. And few companies could order the chips, as design is easy.

modern CPU or GPU is about x10000 more complex to design. only 2 companies make them (amd/intel for cpu), at most 3 for gpu (amd/nvidia/intel).
Oh and that russian CPU, which has terrible performance and doesn't count.

Without spending like 10,000,000,000++ $ in R&D no one will join them in making CPUs on level on par with Zen3.

Level to entry to making ASICs *design* is so easy that we had an OG bitcoiner design one himself, he was the first orders.
And more FABs might be able to bake these chips.

Also, no patents (there was a war with bcash that was related also to this, we won). While CPU certainly have dozens, even more so in GPU.

This is why avoiding centralization in manufacturing of ASICs is easier than with CPUs. Despite first thought that CPUs are all around the world. But with CPU mining in the end what we do get is monopoly of... few botnet operators (which is another, related, topic)

even if current situation would be not good (I think there are many fabs and chip designers already, and even more so of assembled miners)

then ASICs have the best chance of breaking out eventually and competing, while CPUs are totally blocked by extremely complex design that no one will fund.

I’m genuinely impressed at the amount of mental gymnastics you went through trying to claim APPLICATION SPECIFIC hardware is somehow more decentralized than the technology in every home. Congrats!

name one thing Bitcoin is better at

Value accrual, aka the price going up

APPLICATION SPECIFIC hardware is somehow more decentralized than the technology in every home.

it is, because there is more chance of more than oligopoly of 3 biggest corps making them.

windows is in 95% of homes
yet bsd has better chances of being adopted, due to simplicity
it's not perfect analogy so I bet you will try your best to not get it and just paddle same point

But Monero is going up way more

The inflation is so low it doesnt matter

Imagine saying it's ok to store your wealth in an asset that is designed to lose value
Lol lmao rofl

Zoom out

I will rather buy MOVE at 0.2

CPU design is dominated by 1 company totally, all else is noise, but suggesting CPU innovation is over is retarded.

name one thing Bitcoin is better at.

more transactions per block

not an advantage
not an advantage
nonsense you just made up
bullshit you just made up
meaningless
meaningless
ASIC resistance isn't favoring botnets

ASIC dependence = permissioned mining

sort of
you are never gatekept out of ASICs but they're not helping

looks like I'm the only person here technically qualified to compare both chains
monero is a heavier chain because of the ring signatures

Monero cannot do the transaction weight of bitcoin
and Bitcoin cannot do the anonset of ringCTs

you need both chains

any posts below this point without technological literacy will yield the death of the posters mother in her sleep

>>finite emission

>This is a bad thing since Bitcoins future is not secured

the security issues due to no more mining rewards are well known and that's why monero has a tail emission. it is future proof. what happens to bitcoin when there is no more mining reward is unknown.

Never thought I would see someone in 2025 arguing that BTC is a superior chain because of scalability kek

Only against Monero can bitcoin make scalability arguments so easily lol

The price infinitely trending toward zero due to tail emission does not solve anything at all. There is either demand for blockspace, or there is no demand for blockspace.

It takes tard reasoning to think 1% controlled inflation is a problem

1% controlled inflation does not intrinsically guarantee 1% more "stuff" or "value" is being created, and does nothing at all to guarantee security. You either have demand for blockspace or you do not.

The value proposition to bitcoin's hard cap is as much about the immutability of bitcoin as it is the actual monetary policy itself. Monero offers no such value because it hard forks every six months and the monetary policy of Monero is unknowable, both in real time, and hypothetically in the future. There's no way to know for certain what Monero's true inflation even is right now. If someone had discovered an inflation bug in Monero at any point, you would not necessarily know that.

Yawn. Tired old maxi boomer cope

How would you prove that I do not have 500 million XMR in a wallet right now?

Monero gang needs to clarify "assuming there's never been any inflation bug in any of monero's dozens of hard forks, the supply and inflation are as follows"

The value proposition also necessarily includes the caveat of "assuming that no inflation bug is discovered in any future hard fork of monero, which would be unable to be proven or known"